Gen X at 40

Canada's Favorite Blog

Comments

Robert McClelland -

Culture wars suck, eh.

Ben (The Tiger) -

I think it's just Canadians being Canadians, whether in our French or English incarnations -- we don't like loud debates and open disagreements.

It's part of the national character.

David Janes -

Can't we be both?

Alan -

I think there is a very good argument being missed - that Quebec was preserved through the conquest:
1. If Montcalm wins and Quebec gets through to the American Revolution, Quebec loses as the US would clearly have turned on it. Britain would have only had the Maritimes at that point and would not be in a position to take Quebec separately without US colonial militia.
2. if Montcalm wins, Britain leaves and the US somehow does not take out Quebec (impossible) in the 1780s, then France falls to the Revolution and is unable to assist Quebec leading to the US taking Quebec between 1793 and 1800.

It was the Wolfe Manifesto that framed its preservation. It should be celebrated.

Both what?

Chris Taylor -

Even if the US did succeed in taking Quebec militarily, it is a virtual certainty that it would have been sold off by Boney as part of the Louisiana Purchase in 1803. As noted by Alan in an earlier thread.

But that sort of realist interpretation doesn't fly in Canada. British = ungood, except where it intersects with the Pearsonian Year Zero cultural vision.

Ben (The Tiger) -

Here's another realist interpretation -- had Quebec not fallen, the American Revolution would not have happened. Or at the very least, it would have been delayed for at least another half-century.

Great victories bring great instability -- not for nothing does Macpherson's single volume history of the Civil War begin in 1848, in Mexico City.

Renee -

Wait, what's the difference between a fool and an idiot?

Ben (The Tiger) -

Fools are curable, idiots are not. (I think.)

But at any rate, I don't think that Canadians are cowards, fools, or idiots -- just very conflict-averse sorts.

Chris Taylor -

That sounds like a fair trade. Lose Quebec, gain the United States.

Who's got the keys to the Wayback Machine?

Chris Taylor -

Also, Scotland may have lost to the English a couple of times, but eventually they ended up running the place, and then went on an ass-whooping world tour for a few centuries.

Quebec just lost, without any follow-up ass-whooping.

Alan -

A fool has maximized capacity and, as I recall from my undergrad, in Russian culture can be a holy mystic which sees more or rather more purely. Ben can correct me on my Dostoyevski.

So does being conflict adverse mean avoiding any challenge to the point that avoiding strengths and benefits of history - even Quebec's history - are challenged? As far as I understand, the fall of New France was a precondition to the carving off of the arguable "nation," though its pronouncement by Mr. Harper seems to be itself a precondition to an erroneous interpretation.

I think Quebec won because it was abandoned and then cut off from France and granted the autonomy it needed to develop uniquely. All of which required Wolfe winning. If not, then it is not a nation but a satellite.

Ben (The Tiger) -

Your Dostoevsky is accurate, Alan.

Your interpretation of Quebec history is, on the other hand, what French Canadians thought in the late 19th century. (That strange era when francophone politicians were getting knighthoods and baronetcies and pledging their loyalty to the British Empire.)

Doesn't mean that it's a wrong one, though.

Alan -

Done. Sad day for history.

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