Gen X at 40

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gr -

Good thing you aren't in Maine, didn't they get a foot of snow yesterday?
Happy Good Friday, all!

cm -

We got a bit of a dusting here in the big smoke. As for wars and remembering, whenever I hear the phrase "war criminals", I always think of old men and it shocks me to realize that there are men my age (and younger) who are considered to be war criminals.

Alan -

Seeing as my pal's father-in-law spent twenty years as a political prisoner run by the wizards behind the greater Serbian Christian state idea during which time he and other Muslims hacked out mountain bunkers (including runways) for the Yugoslav air force with nothing but picks and shovels, I am surprised only by people's surprise and collective forgetting.

Gordo -

In February, I hard a piece on CBC about an organic cooperative dairy in Wales that was running, for want of a better phrase, wife wanted ads on the side of their milk bottles. The campaign was set to coincide with St. Dwynwen's Day (the Welsh St. Valentine) Apparently, there is a dearth of young Welsh ladies looking to settle down for the farm life and given the modern society's disconnect from all things rural, who can blame them? They have no idea what they're missing. Anyway, the bottle pictures (of eligible young bachelor farmers) and the accompanying website were garnering huge interest at the time, but I can't find any info on long-term success.

Gordo -

Argh "<i>heard</i> a piece on CBC"

Jay Currie -

"burlappy"

I'll rush right out.

And on a side note re Srebrenica: thank God for the UN.

Alan -

And western democracy.

ry -

Al, a coupla things here.
ARen't you employing some broken/unparrallel analogies here? Aren't revenge killings in Indonesia rather unlike boycots and death threats over art? I know coming off the top rope may feel good, but it's still, well, wrong. Sinead O'Connor's treatment after ripping up a photo of the Pope on SNL or "We're bigger than Jesus" seem far more realistic. Or maybe even Tancredo's 'Let's blow up Mecca'.

Indonesia's an odd place. Violence there isn't over something as trite as an editorial cartoon---like I said, revenge killing for other murders and not over offensive art. Yeah, it's a little self congratulatory. So what. The worst that's been done is people booing O'Connor of a stage and driving over her albums and basically the end of her career as a pop artist(open mouth insert foot). That's it. Nobody declared destruction to Ireland for her actions. That's the point. Sure, people were VERY un-Christian to her over it. Gimme a break.

Kosovar situation. Ain't that a little over simplifying the situation? I've heard, from a friend who teaches university in France, that there's TONS of reasons given for anger in Euro-Moslems. Those from Morroco don't typically make that argument according to him(that Bosnian Moslem massacre is a reason for anger now). There's lots of reasons.

And thank The Lord for the UN on this issue? The organization that flat out refused to do anything/was paralyzed from within about it? give me a break. NATO went in, UN picked up the reconstruction after the fact. NATO was drug in kicking and screaming by the WeatherCock President when a critical mass of outrage was reached in N. America. The UN hasn't functioned as it ought, and that doesn't mean always being in lock step with the US, since just after Korea. Too much gamesmanship. Too much honoring the letter of the law and not the spirit. Too much "I'll look the other way over you if you do the same for me" going on in many of the Commissions. I wish it worked. I wish it lived up to the grand promise that it once had. But it doesn't currently live up to said promise and hasn't for quite a while.

Returning to the chocolate Jesus. Simply looking at it as a sculpture: it's phenomenal what the man achieved in terms of detail in chocolate. BUt is it in a sense mocking? I think so. What's reverential about it? Where's the respect of the Religion in the piece even if one hates the religion? Nowhere to be found. If Mohammedians were just, if maybe a little overzealous in expression, of distaste of a picture of Mohammed with a bomb-like turban as being insensitive to their sense of The Divine aren't others allowed the same leeway?

Aren't others allowed to argue 'We of "X" distinct and seperate and superior' even if wrong?

The artist seems to be one of those guys who enjoys being so far out on the edge that most of us look at him like he's from mars with seven purple heads. He succeeded in invoking that response yet again. Why complain about others complaining when that's part and parcel of the intent of making the Chocolate Jesus? Yet another in a long line of 'you stupid Christians' bits of art that come around. (See piss Christ, Mary done in dung, etc). That this was done totally on the private side makes me shake my head at those calling for it to be taken down, as that's what we complained about the Mohommedians doing(it's art, it's free speech, get over it).

I don't like it. I can appreciate the detail and effort; but at the end of the day I hate the piece and have no wish for anyone to see it. That doesn't mean I want gov't to step in and stop it from being shown(though, private organizations doing so is hunky dory with me, CAIR went after fictions in TV and that was fine). Just means I hate it and have one more reason not to like urbanites from NY/NYC since they seem to revel in this kind of thing. Why should I like someone who takes glee in making fun of me and trys to provoke my anger for their amusement? Flunk 'em.

Alan -

Next time try to think about what I am saying before suggesting I am off the mark.

ry -

I don't notice any hint of satire there. It seems the 'self congratulatory' part was earnestly meant. Yet, aren't you going way out of bounds? Isn't showing where the self congratulatory stuff is itself flawed in trully parrallel situations more likely to get thru then this unparrallel 'hammer to their tumb' thing of Indonesia?

Maybe I'm not getting what you intend. subtle isn't always easy for me. Maybe it has to be 2"x4" to the noggin obvious here for me to get. What is you point?

I think it is simply you saying 'Wipe your own nose first, buster.' But in so doing you've employed the hated reduction to absurdity(likening Donahue to Indonesian revenge killers? Come on. that's a bit absurd, ain't it?). Am I wrong?

Was there something else I was supposed to pick up on the self congratulatory element? It is quite possible I simply don't get it. Isn't there a profound difference between being driven to make signs calling for the death of those that 'defile "a"' and being driven to make signs calling for suing someone because they 'defile "a"'? Isn't there a difference between 'Liberation Theology' Catholics in PRC and left leaning Catholics in Boston? Or is that the point and not the self congratulation at all? If it is it was a little too obtuse for me to see without proding(and you might want to turn down the voltage on that cattle prod as it leaves smoking burn marks on skin.).

The Bosnian one is slippery. There's much there. Forgotten tragedies are dangerous things.

Alan -

Start with a premise other than simply being contrarian. Then note that thousands of Muslims were killed by Christian nationalists in only the last decade and how now those blogging triumphalists bent on self-congratulation of those like them forget all those dead. Then ask yourself, if you still do not get it, whether you appear to be a sectarian apologist.

Alan -

I trust this settles it when even the Serbs acknowlege what occurred. Funny how people claim it was a UN failure when it was a failure of the constituent nations to act when needed.

ry -

Did you read where the UN was involved? What is the UN responsible for then? They declared it an enclave under their protection, but, because nations in the UN(Russia) blocked measures to put boots on the ground to stop this from happening, but oh-no, can't be the UN's fault.

The conflict already existed. It was something people were trying to stop. Ethnic Cleansing occured long before and long after this. That's what the UN claimed it was trying to stop. Did it? Did it live up to the job it claims as sole arbiter of(unilateralism being bereft of 'legitimacy' you know)? No. The UN failed to do what it claims its there for. You can dance all you want, Al. But the UN failed, as did the EU, NATO, and the US to stop this nonsense. Just the UN much, much more. The UN decided to interfere with the war, the UN institued measures to keep the Moslems from protecting themselves like arms embargoes. Don't tell me they didn't fail, and fail utterly, because individuals were convicted of war crimes. That's failing to see the forest for a tree(not trees, but a single tree), and I think you know it.

Alan -

The UN is made of its members. The members failed including your country and mine. Why are you so keen to downplay inter-faith murders when it is 8,000 Muslims who died?